The Future of Marketing Involves Web3, Metaverse, & NFTs With Guest Ryan Stewart

Michael  0:01  

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Today I’m talking about how the future of marketing is changing. And crypto NFT’s blockchain and the metaverse is involved. I have a special guest with us, a marketing legend and someone who I have personally followed for years, and you should too. This is a master marketer and Business Builder. I’d like to welcome Ryan Stewart, the CEO of WEBRIS, the podcast. Ryan, it’s a pleasure man to have you here.

Ryan  1:37  

Thanks for having me. Michael is good to be here.

Michael  1:38  

Absolutely. Hey, before we dive in and reveal some gold nuggets to our audience, can you share with our listeners? Just a little bit about yourself?

Ryan  1:46  

Yeah, sure. Absolutely. So I’ve been in the marketing realm for about 13 years now. I got my start in big consulting with Accenture and Deloitte doing some riveting projects on business process reengineering. That was sarcasm. While I learned some great professional lessons there in terms of how to communicate all sorts of things along that line, I quickly realized that it wasn’t a life for me and I took to Google and Yahoo back then it was searching for, you know, alternate ways to make my income and money. And I basically stumbled across what was the infancy of Internet Marketing. And this was before big brands really even believed in the internet, very similar to actually what we’re going to talk about in terms of what people are seeing with web three crypto and not really seeing it as a viable option for business and commerce and all sorts of things. But things obviously picked up over that time, I just dive in headfirst and started learning SEO search engine optimization, building my websites, optimizing them, and creating content along the way. That process of learning and growing and documented pride, a lot of interest in myself ended up picking up some clients. And a few years later was able to start an agency. Ended up selling that agency, rebuilding it back and now have currently running an agency also running a trade with training program for the agencies, I also do some high ticket… If you can call that consulting for some larger brands, currently working with the largest cannabis company (Country) helping them take their cannabis practice online and commerce online. So really anything in the digital space in the marketing space, I’m passionate about it, but also building and managing my own company swells for my clients as well. So that’s kind of 13 years in a nutshell of my experience, if you will, happy to go into detail on any of that as well.

Michael  3:21  

Awesome, Ryan. Hey, man, can you share just a little bit more about you? So your company’s called WEBRIS? Yes?

Ryan  3:27  

Correct. 

Michael  3:27  

And you know, some of your core services… I’m sure a ton of the crypto projects listening to this episode could really use your help. So can you share just a little bit about your current company WEBRIS, that you created.

Ryan  3:39  

For sure. So WEBRIS actually only does Search Engine Optimization. I’m a very type of person and a very type of marketer actually learned this. I was making a joke about it. But in my business process reengineering days, I realized that large companies essentially run on processes and people. That’s really, you know, now we’re getting into the automation space. But you know, 10 – 15 years ago was about people who process. That really stuck with me. And as I began to build my first agency, I realized how much energy went into it in terms of people I didn’t want to scale for people. So I went back to the drawing board. Basically, we call a productized service. So WEBRIS right now as a function is right now you can only hire us to do SEO and we have a very specific approach to working with are called Sprint’s, so we don’t do long term contracts. We don’t do crazy deliverables, like you come for us for more traffic. And that’s pretty much it. So anybody in the crypto space, I think we could expand on that more when it comes to like opportunities in the crypto or web three space. Search engines are always going to be on top of the list in terms of getting people there because they’re wide open. They’re not blacklisted. Like when you start talking about advertising on Facebook and stuff like that. There’s a lot of regulations, a lot of hoops to jump through your ads to get declined a lot. organic traffic from Google is always going to be one of the best ways to market your business as long as people are still using Google, which again, we can talk about as we get into this. So that’s essentially what we do there. But then again, like more of the high tech consulting stuff that I do is much more when we take on two to three projects a year, really for companies that are looking to to really scale and aggressively grow and invest a minimum of 50,000 a month into their marketing, I basically helped to architect that put together processes systems, identify the right marketing channels, if you will help them understand what type of impact that that’s going to have. And then also the level of effort should you hire internally? Should you get a contractor? Should you go get an agency, essentially building and scoping out an entire marketing ecosystem for some of my clients? So we can talk about that as well. I think some of those learnings will apply a lot more to people that are trying to figure out really, what’s the first step to take in this space, because you can pay attention to Gary Vee, who I think is pioneering this for a while, but at the end of the day, there’s there’s not a whole lot of avenues available right now as we see it. It’s almost ironic, if you want to be in web three, you still have to market on web two, for the time being until that traction really picks up so we can explore all that as we get into more.

Michael  5:45  

Absolutely no, I can definitely appreciate the web three and two connections. Can you share with our audience? You know, some of our audience’s concepts may be new to them, you know, other people are extremely familiar. But can you just break down in a nutshell, the difference between web one, two, and three? Because a lot of people hear that a lot, but they may not like dialing in and exactly No? 

Ryan  6:04  

Sure. So for context, I’m not an expert on web one or web three, you know, I’m a student of the game, if anything else I’m learning a lot. When web one came out, it was essentially dial up internet, it was really just, they call it a one way communication, right? You would go, you’d find information and you would consume that information, there was really no back and forth, right? So we’re talking about the early days, this is back, you know, I’m 35 years old, when I was in sixth grade, I remember hitting on a well my first screen, and those are really the web one days a well a, you know, pretending to remember spending hours on there just researching stuff, just consuming information. But the move to web two is really about social, right. So the social web, that’s really where my expertise really starts to pick up. That’s what we’re in the heart of right now. Social Web, communicative web, you know, the sharing economy, whatever you want to call it, that’s really the core of web two. And then as we move to web three, a much more, I guess, decentralized way to explain it, right? It’s actually there’s a whole bunch of different avenues that you can that you can pass down I think from the from a business and marketer point of view, is really understanding the diversion between in web two kinds of companies holding a lot of the power button web three, giving that back to the individual user, right? So for context example, right now, if you’re an influencer, and your platform is Instagram, right, you got 5 million followers, you don’t own that, that doesn’t belong to you, Instagram owns that, you know, and it’s almost kind of funny how humans are and how we act like we opt into these platforms, we sign up for terms of agreements we don’t agree to. And then all of a sudden, Instagram makes one change to the platform that they owned, the platform that you signed up for, the platform that you built your business off of for free, and you go up in arms, well, what three is going to change a lot of that, because just the ability to track in terms of the source, right when you publish a piece of content. Now, for example, if you create like a really funny meme, it sounds stupid to a lot of people, but there’s a lot of money and attention memes, right? You create a meme now web two, it gets screenshotted, shared credit gets convoluted, nobody knows where it really came from, it belongs to the internet, and belongs to Instagram, right. But in web three, we’ll be able to track who the original source of the Creator is, if there’s any sort of monetization attached to that any sort of attribution attached to that in the future, which we can hypothesize what that will look like, it will actually be credited back to the Creator. So we’re moving much more into a true potentially a true creators economy where you’ll be able to get credited and compensated, whether that’s in a tension, which is a lot of what happens now, or actual compensation in terms of money, which is easy to much easier to sift through in terms of blockchain and crypto and all that type of stuff. So that’s kind of my point of view on it. Again, I’m not an expert in any of this. Don’t attack me in the comments. That’s just my understanding of it. And again, we’re all learning. We’re all learning throughout this process, and especially web three of what it’s really going to look like and what it’s really going to entail. So I think anyone for now, it’s just the best guess, because we’re not even at the tip of the iceberg. We’re at the tip, tip, tip of the iceberg. It’s getting a lot of hype and a lot of attention now, and rightfully so. But we’re not even close to what it will be just like with web two, you know, when MySpace came out, you know, that was kind of like the beginning of web two and look at how far we’ve come since then. And all sorts of you know, craziness. So that’s kind of my view on it in a nutshell.

Michael  9:04  

Absolutely. Man, you’ve covered so much. They’re all reminding me back of the AOL days. You know, I used to get the discs from blockbuster growing up in California, you know, taking it all throwback exactly, and taking it all the way to web three. So let’s talk about the future of advertising and involving, you know, like NFT’s Metaverse, web three, etc. You started to unpack a little bit about web three. But how do you see the future of advertising moving in this direction or this area?

Ryan  9:36  

Yeah, so it’s a great question. I can give you my best guess. So like, I think what’s important to understand too, is whether we’re in the real verse or Metaverse, the only thing that really matters is where people’s attention is right. Because whatever people’s attention is, from a business point of view, you’re going to want to try and get in front of them, right? It’s everything that we see. Now it doesn’t matter if it’s Instagram or Tiktok, or Google, whatever it is, is that we’re marketing against attention. We’re selling against the tension. We’re advertising against the tension. And especially now as marketers, I really came up in the web to advertising, Facebook ads, digital ads, completely trackable, for the most part compared to web one, which were not even web one offline, right? We’re talking about 56 years ago, where people put up a billboard, put up a radio spot, and just hoped that sales went up. Right. So we’ve come a long way in terms of track and attribution. But the core of it still is, again, you put up that billboard on a highway, you want to know how many people are driving by, right? Because how many eyeballs is getting the attention factor? Right. So when it comes to web three, I think one of the things that especially marketers and businesses are confused and probably fearful and scared about is if everyone is living in the metaverse, how can I continue to run my business? In a place where there is no Instagram and Facebook? Right? There is no Google. Right? And I think I have a lot of thoughts on that. I think first and foremost, we’re pretty far away from being in any sort of Metaverse, Ready Player One type of space, I know a lot of people, including myself, will play into it, hype it up a little bit talking about, you know, the income gap and all these different things and how people are, I mean, it is happening, right? It’s really sad. I mean, just you know, people, people all around us are struggling in this country as well, to just even work. Nobody wants to work the whole nine. So it is starting to play out a little bit. But I have an Oculus, and like, I personally can’t wear it for more than 12 minutes, because I get pretty bad motion sickness with it. And like, it’s also it’s just not at the point where it’s ready to get to the point where anybody has even started thinking about how am I going to advertise in web three? Right. However, with that being said, what I do see happening is, the more that people are spending their time up there, we’re going to find ways to get their attention up there, whether that’s going back to billboards inside of like the sandbox or something like that, or sponsored opportunities to get, I don’t know order Domino’s Pizza, you know, while you’re walking around sandbox, you know, so like, I think that we’re we’re a long ways away to the point where like, I don’t even think you really have to be worried about it. Unless you are a web three company, unless you are a crypto company, then of course, it’s definitely time to get early adopter in trying to figure out ways that you can get in front of people inside of you know, the metaverse inside of these sandbox, which isn’t in the metaverse yet, you know, inside of these kinds of communities, if you will, are these worlds versus to really try and get people’s attention. But the concepts are still the same. I mean, literally going back to, you know, training a copywriter right now for my business. And we start with stuff from the 60s, you know, I’m not looking at stuff on Facebook, right? Like, again, the core, the core of what we’re doing hasn’t really changed. We’re still speaking to humans, we’re still trying to communicate with humans, we’re still trying to get attention from humans, the platforms are much more advanced, the platforms are much more confusing, the platforms are much different. But we’re still speaking to humans. And I think that’s that’s key here is that we’re still wherever attention is, your business is going to want to be there marketers who want to be their advertising is going to be there. But in terms of the core messaging, in terms of the core human emotions, and really biases, if you will, that we’re trying to advertise against haven’t changed, and they won’t change, right, there’s obviously gonna be nuances in terms of how we communicate in terms of what we communicate, but humans are humans. And we’re still driven and motivated by the same kind of core beliefs, the same values that we have been for hundreds of years now that advertising companies have played against, you know, so I think my core point here is that like, don’t worry about it right now. It’s not something that you need to really prepare for or freak out for, there’s still a lot of money and attention to be made in the current Internet, it’s going to be that way for a significant amount of time, a minimum of 10 years, in my opinion. So I think it’s good to start having conversations and listen to podcasts like this, just like I’m doing like I’ll say it all the time. I don’t consider myself a Metaverse expert, but I have spent the time understanding it and buying it and trying to feel it and understand because it’s important. But that time period is when it’s happening. I’m not going to abandon everything I’m doing now, because it’s just not ready for that level yet.

Michael  13:50  

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Definitely. No I definitely agree with a lot of what you said and you actually took me back to before web one, you know, before practically the internet, my first business when I was a teen, you know, it was the Yellow Pages, and it was car signage and people driving by, you know, when I had a showroom of in California was retail at that time and you know, to see… But you’re right when even when you take it all the way back to what you’re looking for now, a copywriter where you’re still dealing with people, you know, there’s usually a desire or there’s pain, right for the reasons why they’re gonna purchase or something in between. And I’m I definitely believe we’re in in between, we’re here with web two and three, you know, the, it is here, you know, the beginning of the metaverse, the next 60 months, I believe will be a lot of progress made on the dev side on building out a lot of these platforms. You know, a lot of the verses, a lot of these virtual worlds and metaverse. I know of some big players that will be entering, you know, the market, if you will. And so that’s going to be and you know, and then it’s going to take some time for adoption, even for that aspect of it later. So yeah, I think you hit the nail in the head and a 10 year frame. Definitely it’s important, if people are in marketing to definitely see the future as where we’re going. And if you’re in crypto blockchain or web three, you know, I myself and looking at, you know, NFT’s and virtual land to have my brand and to build my brand. And then the question is, which ones, you know, which ones are, you know, are the Nike, the Facebook, you know, the IG of tomorrow, inside the verse, right? So let’s talk about some of the community marketing, because that pretty much, you know, it doesn’t matter if it’s web, you know, one, two, or three or even, you know, when I was growing up when there wasn’t a web, you know, it’s marketing to people and building community, you know?

Ryan  16:48  

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I spent a good amount of time researching and understanding NFTs and I feel like I’ve gotten a good handle on the why, which is to me the most important as a marker, like, why are people spending this much money? Why are people spending this much time? Why are people changing their entire online persona to be part of it, and it comes down to that it’s community and people’s again, like what I said, when it comes to marketing and advertising, people are not complicated. When you really understand what drives people to action, you see that playing out in NFT’s at scale right now, right? Number one is people want a sense of community, it goes all the way back to human evolution. It’s just we congregate. It’s why we build cities. It’s why we build towns, it’s why you get uncomfortable living all the way out in the woods by yourself. It’s just not how we’re programmed, right. So again, like a lot of the stuff we see just human psychology and human evolution, literally just playing out at scale with NFT. So like communities and people wanting to display these NFT’s as their profile picture to show that they’re part of this. On top of that, which I think is even more prevalent in today’s world. Like when you look at the rise of really the rise in the domination of high end luxury products and goods. This feeling of wanting to show how successful we are as humans is another kind of human emotion psychology thing. It’s what we see happening with NFT’s too; this flex, if you will, wanting to show that. Without saying it, without saying how much money you make. And we see that happening now with brands like Bored APE Club and Crypto Punks. These people know if you know, you know, right and if you see somebody with a Bored APE, you know that it’s probably worth a quarter million dollars or more. That’s a flex, you know, it’s not just one it’s wanting to be a part of the community. But it’s also the fact that like you’re joining this, you’re elevating yourself inside of that community by owning that piece of APE, if you will.

Michael  18:40  

Regarding the luxury goods. You know, I definitely agree board people see Bored APE club, or they see Crypto Punks, and they automatically identify it as a Flex is similar to pulling up into a super nice sports car, everybody sees you or women have animes bags, you know, or Cartier jewelry or something like that. So it is part of you know, how we as humans do community, things like that. You also touch previously on on the actual community. And I think even before the internet, one thing we can all identify as sports teams, sports arenas, you know, you go in there and there’s a tribe of people they’re very passionate about, you know, that topic, right. And I love soccer football myself, depending on where you’re from. So, yeah, 100% Yeah. And we’re gonna see a lot more changing in the game within an NFTs and NFTs with utility, you know, we’ll probably see concert tickets and events that we can go to buy the NFT get in and and get some kind of free goodie, you know.

Ryan  19:38  

I think that’s going to actually happen sooner than we think. But I do think the challenge with that though is that part is actually kind of easy, like turn it like for the Ticketmaster to turn those tickets in NFT’s like already kind of halfway there. It just got put on the blockchain like you already get a digital ticket that lives on your phone, right like, it’s not that much of a stretch to think that I think the biggest thing is that one hardware companies are gonna have to come with like built in wallets because like, dude, setting that stuff up, yes, not easy. And like, you’ve got like, it’s something you have to dedicate like an entire Saturday to like watching YouTube videos and like figuring out, there’s a lot of friction to getting into this stuff. And I do think that’s gonna be the biggest hindrance for this like, and then you had like, like my parents, like, they’re never going to do it. Even if somebody does a forum, like they’re never going to get it. So like, that’s why I also think this is going to take longer, because like, we’re gonna have like a fractured population that like was gonna take us years and years and years, decades at mass adoption for this and less hardware companies come out and they’re like, no, like, it’s part of this now like, yeah, like the concept of NFT’s. Like, if you think about it, it’s like, from a layman’s point of view, like the phone already does all that the phone already is a wallet, we’re just not using it on the blockchain. So I think when the hardware takes that step, that’s when we’ll see more mass adoption. And then it’s just going to be a landslide after that, because until then, it’s too much friction to ask anybody really to be like, Hey, take your entire Saturday, Sunday, and like, learn about this and set this up, just so you can get like… Because we’re doing this for our business too. Like we’re… we give away NFTs for people that pet for our other business, our training business, like certificates, right? So, participation, and NFTs, they use basically like accrue points, and then you’ll get an entity based on that. And that NFT will then unlock coaching you it’ll unlock like a live event that we’re doing and just kind of access and things like that. And the biggest thing that we’re hitting is people that are like, Yeah, I don’t have a wallet set up. So yeah, you know, it’s still the biggest block in terms of mass adoption, because it’s not difficult to understand if it’s not like you’re doing our phone. But like, when you try and sit down and figure it out. It’s like, okay, this is a little bit overwhelming. Even for me who works in technology, you know.

Michael  21:40  

We got some good news regarding that area. There’s, there’s dapps that have been hard at work. In this area. I had Nick from Divi, Divi project on here, Divi just recently partnered with La Liga 2.7 billion viewers yearly. And they’re going to be in the stadiums, and they’ve made their wallet super simple. And they’re going to be, you know, in La Liga games, physically, they’re showing fans showing the players, and there’s some other ones in the industry that have made it as simple as three clicks. And we’re gonna, you know, we’re working on showcasing and bringing some of that forward. And hopefully some of my colleagues in the industry can, you know, put the word out, because I totally agree with you, you know, my parents, for example, are not technical, just like you mentioned yours. Right. And, and a lot of people listen to this podcast, you know, it’s called New to crypto. So a certain percentage of our listeners are new, and a certain percentage of people are very experienced, and they don’t want to know about a specific topic, right? But for the people that are new, you know, they come from maybe an investing background, you know, or they have businesses, but you know, crypto is new. And it’s not exactly the easiest thing to navigate. So the positive info and the new info is that there is a problem that needs to be solved. And in terms of making this very simple for the average, any person with a non tech, non dev background, and the developers are hard at work at that. And I think we should see this year and beyond some big changes in that area. So you know, so you don’t have to figure out how to do a Metamask wallet on your weekend.

Ryan  23:08  

Yeah, it wasn’t, again, even for me, somebody who spends all their time online, I was like, I got to the point I was very close was like eff this because like, it’s not easy, man. It’s really not like there’s a lot of friction, which is also why I’m so bullish on this, because so many people have taken, even Discord, like I look at Discord, and I’m like, No, I can’t. It’s just like, it’s like I’m a Slack user. Like, that’s how I run my companies is through slack. And I look at Discord. And I like the UI the UX is a, like a designer market point of view is so bad, like people are still spending time to figure it out and use it. It’s also tied into the gaming community, which you know, I know is a part of the gaming community, which I’m not a gamer, it’s a bit in my blood to do that. So but that’s why I’m also bullish on this because like, so many people are spending so much time and energy on this I like, and then once you’re in like, then you kind of get it in like you have to go through that process of setting it. I tell people all the time, like, Look, you don’t have to like, invest a ton of crypto, you don’t have to be the metaverse, you don’t have to do that. But like, you should dedicate one of your Saturdays to going through it. Because once you do, you’re going to understand it, you know, like it’s just yeah, it’s a different level. It’s a different feeling. And you realize that it’s not that complicated. Once you’re in there, you know, and like, once you understand the concept of NFTs and like why people are buying NFTs, especially, like you said, it’s like the same feeling you get the same feeling, right? Like people don’t buy a Lamborghini, for any other reason. I shouldn’t say this, but like, for the most part, it’s about a feeling that you want for yourself, you want the feeling of people seeing you and you want the feeling of driving it. Yeah, feeling is the same when you have something that’s $250,000 Even though it’s a picture to you to most people, it’s not, it has value and that value communicates to the outside world something about you as a person. And that feeling in itself is one of the most powerful feelings that a human can have. And again, that’s why we see people spending $1,000 for a T shirt that says Gucci on it, but it’s the exact same T shirt that you can get from American Apparel for the most part, you know like I think for the t shirt, you’re paying for the logo, because that’s what you want to communicate to the world, about your status about who you are about your success in the world, all these different things. And I think a lot of younger people get it that they’re like, Okay, I see this on Instagram all the time, I follow this account called, like NFT’s, whatever. And like the law was, like, go up to people on the street and be like, Okay, here’s a picture of a Hurricane. And here’s a picture of a board, like, like it’s just mental notes Bored APE, but like, which one’s your other half. And everyone’s like, of course, I’d rather have brought up the car. But except for people that are better, like hip hop on NFTs, because they’re like, only a handful of people are actually going to see me driving that car, right? But if I can make up my social profile, like, potentially 1000s and 10s of 1000s, people are gonna see this. Again, it’s not about having a physical car, because anything that you buy physically in this world over time loses its value emotionally to you, right? Like, you buy a car, it’s a great feeling. But over time, you’re like, Okay, on to the next thing. It’s just, it’s how we’re wired, you know. So it’s about that feeling. And it’s about the feeling that we get in what we want to communicate to the world. And if more people can see, give you that feeling by just posting that as your Twitter Instagram picture. That’s really what’s happening. That’s why this is hitting so much mass adoption, because people are living more and more time on their phones, right here. This is where people are living. This is the reality, this is what they see. So it doesn’t matter if it happens in real life or not. I think that’s what a lot of the older generation struggles with, it’s not real. It’s like it is real, because it’s a feeling and as long as you feel it, then it’s real, like what are you to say what’s real or not anymore? You know, and I think that’s a very scary thing for people. But again, like, you don’t have to buy into it, like I’ve never had, like, I talk about the stuff but but like, I’m never gonna live in the metaverse like, I’m gonna live in real life, you know, that’s just my choice, in my opinion. But other people are going to, if I want to continue to be successful in this world, and I want to raise my kids in the world and position them for success, and it’s something that like we have to do and have to understand, or, you know, you’re just gonna get left by the wayside. Unfortunately, you know, it’s the same with business. Absolutely. Like, again, like, I’ll never forget, like, 10 years ago, when I tried to pitch Instagram marketing to like businesses that were like, being a thing. And I’m like, okay, yeah. And then like, now, like, in what happened to those businesses, you know, like, failure to adopt the putting your head in the sand and like plowing forward, because it’s the same, like the same thing that got you here isn’t gonna get you there, you know, like, so again, you have time. And that’s kind of the beauty about like, people listening to this now is that like, you still have so much time. Like, you don’t have to go and spend all your money on NFT’s and, you know, like, live in the metaverse, you don’t, but like, it’s worth your time to understand it’s worth your time to listen to content like this, it’s worth the time to educate yourself, because it’s coming, and you’ll be prepared for it. And you’re gonna be more prepared than 90% of the rest of the world who is saying that this stuff is stupid, you know?

Michael  27:36  

Absolutely. No, that’s, that’s a good point. I mean, a lot of my episodes are bite sized pieces, the non interviews are 10 minutes long. It’s so people on the go, people that are busy, can just learn in bite sized pieces. And you know, just day after day, you know, things like that. Let’s talk about what else you see in the future of marketing with this ever changing environment? Is there anything else you want to touch on that you see aside from community marketing, and NFTs and Metaverse and things like that? 

Ryan  28:06  

I took a very, like, step back, like realistic approach. I look at humans, you know, like, again, like, at the end of the day, these are just platforms that we’re using to communicate our messaging, but that messaging, and I’m still talking to humans, you know, understanding what motivates humans, and why is one of the most impactful things you can do so like, for example, I just started doing a lot of TikTok marketing, I hired some couple of kids that have like writing scripts for me and filming for me, it’s a different type of contents a different style, but the messaging is still the same. You know, same thing with a podcast. The thing with YouTube, like these are just platforms that people are using to consume the content that people are using, and spending their time on. I think the most important thing is understanding the context of the platform. So like understanding the context of why some users Tiktok versus listening to a podcast while they’re walking their dog versus watching the YouTube video, versus putting on a headset and going into the metaverse, right. Like its context is everything. But the mechanism is still going to be some sort of content is what Gary Vee talks about. I’m a Gary Vee fan, but I’m also not everything because I think that I think he’s like, honestly, I think that like anything that he talks about usually becomes true, because he has a very good pulse on what’s happening. Like the stuff with NFT’s. He’s just very early with a lot of stuff, which creates a lot of backlash for him. But I think he’s okay with that. Because I think his favorite thing in life is saying, I told you so. But like, you know, like he talks about content, content, content, which I agree with. But what he doesn’t talk about is context, right? And context is actually what’s the most important because you can’t just like, what a lot of people will do is like, they’ll film something like this a podcast, and then we’ll try and turn it into a TikTok video, but like you take an hour long conversation and try to condense it into 10 seconds. It’s difficult, right? So you have to understand the context. And even more than that, again, like the style of content on TikTok is drastically different than even like you can’t just tick a TikTok and posts on Instagram are different. It’s just different. Everything is different. The algorithm is different. The people are different, how they’re consuming, when they’re consuming. It’s just different, right? So in my opinion that like, these things don’t matter and that’s why I’m so so common, I’m able to take a long term approach on businesses because I’m like, I’m not tripping, that Facebook ads might go away next month, because we still have a great business with a great offer with great people in life, we know how to take that and contextualize it to whatever is coming next. So like, again, moving on to TikTok, moving on to YouTube ads, as opposed to Facebook ads, moving into NFT style marketing and community marketing, it’s all the same thing, right? It’s just understanding people, understanding what people want, how to make offers to them, how they think, what motivates them, and what gives them that… what makes them feel, you know, like, what are the certain things that we’re trying to make them feel with our messaging that’s ultimately gonna make them take action, like I talk about this all the time. To me, the role of marketing is to get reactions and drive emotions within people, right? Role of sales is to generate leads and close people, right? If we’re talking about b2b or b2c, the role of marketing is to get people to feel something that makes them want to take action, right? So you know, when it comes to, you know, like marketing, our agency, whoever It’s the feeling that I’m trying to give people is almost kind of like the feeling of FOMO/your competitors are eating your lunch, right, because if somebody else is ranking on top of Google, they’re taking your customers, so I can give them that’s going to drive them to want to book a call and talk to us about how we can help. Right? So it doesn’t matter if I’m sending that messaging on Facebook or TikTok, or on a YouTube video, it’s that feeling and understanding he was psychology, what drives them to action that as long as people are still people, as long as we don’t become cyborgs, which we might, and I see the future of marketing is the same, right? Just like if you go back to 1980. And you study you study, like old school advertising, messaging, it’s actually one of my favorite things to do. We have a great coffee table book, that’s old ads, and you just look at it, you’re like, Damn these, they were so good with words and like in like, one picture, you know, being able to communicate so much emotion, so much feeling it but it hasn’t changed. You know, it’s just it’s yes, we’re communicating that’s changed.

Michael  31:53  

Well said Ryan. Man, that was such a group of gold nuggets for our audience and the context part. And you know, how you broke down all the different platforms, especially for all the people that have crypto projects, listening, and businesses, you know, we really appreciate all the value providing here today and even took me back to the ads, you know, my own grandfather, when I was a toddler, you know, that’s what he did those display ads for a very large, you know, newspaper in the United States back in the day, so I’m actually gonna have to get that coffee table book, you know, my coffee table is all exclusive specialty coffee. I’m a big coffee buff, but I need to find out about that.

Ryan  32:33  

It’s fascinating man, you can learn so much, it’s kind of a lost art, you know, if you go to like, so I also had the benefit of working at a very large advertising agency, contractor, performance marketing, but, you know, I was working with advertising teams. And, you know, at the time, I thought it was kind of a lot of like, bullshit, because it would spend so much time like, we’re talking about like, hundreds of 1000s of dollars in meetings, like talking about these things. And I’m like, it doesn’t really matter that much. But I’m coming from a digital point of view, where I’m like, just put it out and tested, and let’s figure it out, versus something that lives in print is kind of forever, and you can’t really change it. So like, you know, like, the level of, you know, I think one of the hardest things to do in life is to say more by saying less, right? And I think that’s getting key, it’s almost coming back. Because, you know, we can still do long form content, but we look at something like tick tock and it’s like, you know, how do you communicate something in a very short period of time, you know, in a very short amount. And then when you look at old school advertising, it’s masterfully done with like four to six words of like, the amount of they can communicate with a single image. You know, I think every marketer should go back and review those because it’s kind of a lost art because we have video now and we can say so much and so short, you know, yeah, all sorts of different things. But it’s really a lost art, like the art of copywriting, the art of, you know, print and display advertising, stuff like that. Really gone by the wayside, and a lot of ways but still very valuable and useful for marketers and advertisers to learn from.

Michael  33:55  

Absolutely. Well said, Man, I definitely appreciate you coming out here. And, you know, sharing so many golden nuggets for our audience, you know, all your links are on the episode Blog Post page for today on our site. So what’s the best way that you prefer for people to be able to reach out to you or you and your team,

Ryan  34:13  

If you’re active on Twitter, it’s Ryanwashere. YouTube, I’m always publishing there too, just look up Brian Stewart from both of those you’ll be able to there’s a link in my bio, if you want to schedule a time we can talk about your business, you know, talk about marketing simply because it’s helped you out.

Michael  34:25  

Absolutely. Awesome. Hey, Ryan, it was a pleasure, man. Thanks for coming out and being part of today. Thanks for having me, Michael. Glad we did it. Excellent. You’re welcome back anytime. Appreciate it. If you liked today’s episode, definitely like it. Subscribe to the podcast. If you’re on YouTube or Spotify. Click the little bell notification so you know about the next episode, which rolls out tomorrow. Until then, make it a great day.

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